Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Discussion regarding the site itself. This includes the upcoming Version 7. Also comments about the site, suggestions for V7, questions about XT, problems with your life, and errors — ooh I hates those errors!
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TerranRich
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by TerranRich »

Papa Faf wrote: August 15th, 2023, 8:34 pm I believe the intention of the bio section is just for information, not a description like Wikipedia. So it would have things like real name, birthday, hometown, finishing move, etc.
Exactly. It was just filler text, but I also added links to show a possibility of how pages could link to one another. But your ideas are better.

I'm a doer. Give me a plan, I'll execute it and put it into action. But I am NOT a planner. :lol:
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by TerranRich »

The Fiend wrote: August 16th, 2023, 12:45 pm I would love a feature for the Advanced Search to be able to search by Year and Event too.

It would be extremely helpful if you've taken a break from collecting for a few months to be able to say search 2023 and see all the listings used from this year.

And searching by events, if I searched WrestleMania and every theme first used at a WrestleMania pops up.
Ooh, yeah, these advanced search ideas are great. I can definitely incorporate them eventually.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by TerranRich »

Christopher wrote: August 16th, 2023, 1:42 pm
The Fiend wrote: August 16th, 2023, 12:45 pm I would love a feature for the Advanced Search to be able to search by Year and Event too.

It would be extremely helpful if you've taken a break from collecting for a few months to be able to say search 2023 and see all the listings used from this year.

And searching by events, if I searched WrestleMania and every theme first used at a WrestleMania pops up.
Yes! And production libraries, too.

I think it would also be neat to have the search be able to exclude terms as well. If you search up "Uncaged X" in the album field, for example, you'd also get results that include every other Uncaged album with an X in it of which there are 6.
The way the Drupal CMS (content management system) handles and stores data, this will be easily done. 👍
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by TerranRich »

antdogs wrote: April 28th, 2020, 1:22 pm yo yo what up everyone! me Old ass AntDogs.. turned 38 Thursday :/ but I haven't been much on forums much but trying to get back into the game. I see some of you on twitter and on some discord chats.. wanna say waaazup
ANTDOGS! I'm sorry I missed this. So you're... wait...

You're the same age as me. I'm 41, so you'd be 41 too now, right? :lol:
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by TerranRich »

TheImpCaiman wrote: May 31st, 2022, 10:58 am Not sure if this has been brought up yet but is there a way to have an Edit button to edit the comments you make on the superstars page comments? Sometimes I'll misword something or say something wrong and need to edit what I said and the quickest way so far is to copy what I initially posted, delete the post, then paste and edit before posting the comment. I thought an Edit button for the comments section would be easier way to do this so I thought I'd ask.

Another thing I believe was brought up by another user but a system for users to check off themes they own?
1 - This is actually a really good idea. I can work on this and easily implement it in a day or two.

2 - This is... also actually a really good idea, and I'm glad several people are calling for it. I didn't even think of this. I can add a table in the database that links users to themes, and there can be a checkbox feature for whether you own a theme in your collection or not. This would take longer than #1 above, so I might do it at some point in the near future.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by TerranRich »

EddieK wrote: November 24th, 2021, 1:44 am
The Fiend wrote: November 23rd, 2021, 11:17 am Any chance of a checklist feature in the new update? It'd be nice if when taking a break from theming, you just come back here and see names/themes highlighted that aren't in your collection. Much more useful than just browsing through the Theme Updates tab.
That would be great honestly. A "where you last left off" feature would be perfect.
Christopher wrote: November 26th, 2021, 4:43 pm I agree. Something like on the forums here, where you can go to "New posts" to see what was posted since you were last on, and in those topics the new posts are marked so you know exactly where you left off (just like they were here, since I've been offline since last weekend).
That would take quite a bit of work on V6, but maybe less work on V7. So this is a "nice-to-have" feature, something I'll most likely do in the future.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by TerranRich »

The Chosen One wrote: November 28th, 2021, 3:48 pm Export companies to CSV or XLS or some other format?
I could add some kind of export feature to the current site. Not a high priority, so it's a "nice-to-have". Can also be done on V7.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by TerranRich »

IAmNeomic wrote: August 24th, 2022, 3:28 pm My only gripe with the current layout is listing the artists when there's an artist line in the info panels. It just makes some of the listings kind of cluttered when there's multiple artists on one song, like "King Darkness" having Def Rebel, Jim Johnston, Tommy Vext, and Jimi Bell.

But yeah, I do like the idea of having a checkbox system in V7, if it ever comes out. I have multiple copies of themes around my library anyways, so I wouldn't really mind having to check off stuff like "Astros", since I would wanna make sure I have it in everyone's different folders and such anyways.
I can easily add a user preference to the current site to toggle the artist line on/off. This is a good point! And very simple to do. Will do soon.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by TerranRich »

bubbafan2 wrote: August 24th, 2022, 10:29 pm
IAmNeomic wrote: August 24th, 2022, 3:28 pm My only gripe with the current layout is listing the artists when there's an artist line in the info panels. It just makes some of the listings kind of cluttered when there's multiple artists on one song, like "King Darkness" having Def Rebel, Jim Johnston, Tommy Vext, and Jimi Bell.

But yeah, I do like the idea of having a checkbox system in V7, if it ever comes out. I have multiple copies of themes around my library anyways, so I wouldn't really mind having to check off stuff like "Astros", since I would wanna make sure I have it in everyone's different folders and such anyways.
Maybe there could be separate fields for “Artist” and “Featuring”. Considering how many entries have featured artists, it might be worth adding so things don’t get so cluttered.

Personally, I think it would be cool to see something specifying exactly how the featured artists are contributing, something like “Featuring: Jimi Bell (guitar), Tommy Vext (vocals), etc. Although that would probably be a LOT of work.
This is a very good idea. I'm actually going to alter how I'm storing Artists in V7 to accommodate this. Thank you for this!

Each Artist (which is what's called a taxonomy vocabulary, each Artist being a "term") can have a field for Contribution/etc. for the "guitar"/"vocals"/etc. part. As for the current site... ehhh probably not. ;)
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by TerranRich »

IAmNeomic wrote: April 12th, 2023, 3:54 am Might be worth using ChatGPT to potentially speed up the process of V7, or maybe doing like a 6.5.

It's an AI chat bit that understands all programming languages, and people are starting to use it a lot for building websites, apps, games, etc. super quickly.
LMAO! What do you think I've been doing for V7?

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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by GodzFire »

TerranRich wrote: August 17th, 2023, 6:54 pm
I hope you can also check out this post regarding including tag teams/stables in a individual's theme count: viewtopic.php?p=96649#p96649

I'll copy paste what I said since this thread's been active and it relates to V7:
---------------------------
I know this is a decade plus old topic and I don't know how it was decided to go, sure I sure as heck hope it was to keep a stable/team's theme in a single wrestler's count and in chronological order.

This seems like an absolute no brainer to me and I can't understand why people would have it any other way. It's a simple matter of common sense and logic.

Like someone used as an example, take Shawn Michaels from the Rockers. You're going to tell me in the SEVEN YEARS that they were together and where he wrestled at one time or another a singles match, you are not going to list that in his count? What did he come out to then- silence, the Benny Hill Chicken Dance theme? Who knows, since according to that logic it never happened, because it was never included in the list. It does a complete disservice to trying to accurately catalog songs used.

---------------------------

I also want to further clarify this again by using Shawn's count: https://xylotthemes.com/#!/themes/wwe/shawnmichaels . Currently, it shows his first theme he used was Rock Out on February 11th, 1990. But wait a sec, the Rockers debuted on June 18, 1988 with their Rock Out theme. Someone will then potentially say: "Well that's because the rockers are a separate listing and Shawn never used it himself until Feb 1990".

Stop and actually think about that logic and you'll realize how flawed that is. According to the listing right now Shawn didn't have a theme until 1990. "But we know he did", oh yea, show me by his listing we know. In addition, look at The Rockers count, looks to me like they used 5 themes together. Shawn was a part of the Rockers right, he wrestled all that time they used those different ones right? Yes? Then those need to be included on Shawn's listing. He didn't come out to nothing, and unless there are entries there that document it, it's just as accurate as making the claim he came out to silence.

Along the same lines if a wrestler comes out and wrestles in a match as a stable, that COUNTS. We'll use The Rock: https://xylotthemes.com/#!/themes/wwe/rock . His Nation themes are listed true, but they're only included when he used them in singles matches. Not when he was part of a mixed stable tag match or multiple member stable match. That should go hand in hand with the rule of thumb above.

Anyone arguing otherwise is ruining the historical accuracy of the database's integrity.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by Papa Faf »

GodzFire wrote: August 18th, 2023, 5:46 pm
TerranRich wrote: August 17th, 2023, 6:54 pm
I hope you can also check out this post regarding including tag teams/stables in a individual's theme count: viewtopic.php?p=96649#p96649

I'll copy paste what I said since this thread's been active and it relates to V7:
---------------------------
I know this is a decade plus old topic and I don't know how it was decided to go, sure I sure as heck hope it was to keep a stable/team's theme in a single wrestler's count and in chronological order.

This seems like an absolute no brainer to me and I can't understand why people would have it any other way. It's a simple matter of common sense and logic.

Like someone used as an example, take Shawn Michaels from the Rockers. You're going to tell me in the SEVEN YEARS that they were together and where he wrestled at one time or another a singles match, you are not going to list that in his count? What did he come out to then- silence, the Benny Hill Chicken Dance theme? Who knows, since according to that logic it never happened, because it was never included in the list. It does a complete disservice to trying to accurately catalog songs used.

---------------------------

I also want to further clarify this again by using Shawn's count: https://xylotthemes.com/#!/themes/wwe/shawnmichaels . Currently, it shows his first theme he used was Rock Out on February 11th, 1990. But wait a sec, the Rockers debuted on June 18, 1988 with their Rock Out theme. Someone will then potentially say: "Well that's because the rockers are a separate listing and Shawn never used it himself until Feb 1990".

Stop and actually think about that logic and you'll realize how flawed that is. According to the listing right now Shawn didn't have a theme until 1990. "But we know he did", oh yea, show me by his listing we know. In addition, look at The Rockers count, looks to me like they used 5 themes together. Shawn was a part of the Rockers right, he wrestled all that time they used those different ones right? Yes? Then those need to be included on Shawn's listing. He didn't come out to nothing, and unless there are entries there that document it, it's just as accurate as making the claim he came out to silence.

Along the same lines if a wrestler comes out and wrestles in a match as a stable, that COUNTS. We'll use The Rock: https://xylotthemes.com/#!/themes/wwe/rock . His Nation themes are listed true, but they're only included when he used them in singles matches. Not when he was part of a mixed stable tag match or multiple member stable match. That should go hand in hand with the rule of thumb above.

Anyone arguing otherwise is ruining the historical accuracy of the database's integrity.
We're not counting team/stable use in solo listings if that's what you're saying. Solo listings are for solo use. If he used it solo for that first time in 1990, then that's accurate and that's how it will stay.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by EddieK »

Papa Faf wrote: August 18th, 2023, 7:17 pm
GodzFire wrote: August 18th, 2023, 5:46 pm
TerranRich wrote: August 17th, 2023, 6:54 pm
I hope you can also check out this post regarding including tag teams/stables in a individual's theme count: viewtopic.php?p=96649#p96649

I'll copy paste what I said since this thread's been active and it relates to V7:
---------------------------
I know this is a decade plus old topic and I don't know how it was decided to go, sure I sure as heck hope it was to keep a stable/team's theme in a single wrestler's count and in chronological order.

This seems like an absolute no brainer to me and I can't understand why people would have it any other way. It's a simple matter of common sense and logic.

Like someone used as an example, take Shawn Michaels from the Rockers. You're going to tell me in the SEVEN YEARS that they were together and where he wrestled at one time or another a singles match, you are not going to list that in his count? What did he come out to then- silence, the Benny Hill Chicken Dance theme? Who knows, since according to that logic it never happened, because it was never included in the list. It does a complete disservice to trying to accurately catalog songs used.

---------------------------

I also want to further clarify this again by using Shawn's count: https://xylotthemes.com/#!/themes/wwe/shawnmichaels . Currently, it shows his first theme he used was Rock Out on February 11th, 1990. But wait a sec, the Rockers debuted on June 18, 1988 with their Rock Out theme. Someone will then potentially say: "Well that's because the rockers are a separate listing and Shawn never used it himself until Feb 1990".

Stop and actually think about that logic and you'll realize how flawed that is. According to the listing right now Shawn didn't have a theme until 1990. "But we know he did", oh yea, show me by his listing we know. In addition, look at The Rockers count, looks to me like they used 5 themes together. Shawn was a part of the Rockers right, he wrestled all that time they used those different ones right? Yes? Then those need to be included on Shawn's listing. He didn't come out to nothing, and unless there are entries there that document it, it's just as accurate as making the claim he came out to silence.

Along the same lines if a wrestler comes out and wrestles in a match as a stable, that COUNTS. We'll use The Rock: https://xylotthemes.com/#!/themes/wwe/rock . His Nation themes are listed true, but they're only included when he used them in singles matches. Not when he was part of a mixed stable tag match or multiple member stable match. That should go hand in hand with the rule of thumb above.

Anyone arguing otherwise is ruining the historical accuracy of the database's integrity.
We're not counting team/stable use in solo listings if that's what you're saying. Solo listings are for solo use. If he used it solo for that first time in 1990, then that's accurate and that's how it will stay.
This! The counts won’t change.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by Y2Jayne »

GodzFire wrote: August 18th, 2023, 5:46 pm This seems like an absolute no brainer to me and I can't understand why people would have it any other way. It's a simple matter of common sense and logic.
Sounds condescending and intolerant to people who disagree with that way of listing (I'd like to point out that I don't care about the listings, I just don't like that tone).
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by GodzFire »

Y2Jayne wrote: August 19th, 2023, 8:40 am Sounds condescending and intolerant to people who disagree with that way of listing (I'd like to point out that I don't care about the listings, I just don't like that tone).
Displaying proper intentions via text is always iffy and definitely not my preferred way to communicate. My response was based on analytical and logistical reasoning, if that helps.

Not having the themes included is not telling the whole accurate story of a person's theme history usage. The argument is that these are solo listings only, and the implication that if someone wants to also see tag/stable entries they have to go to those.

Here's the problem: How does someone know that wrestler was in tag teams/stables, when, and what themes were used?
• Pretend I am completely new to the hobby and have no knowledge.
• I look up Shawn Michaels to see what themes he used. If I go off of Shawn's listing with no prior knowledge, I would believe that Shawn's first theme and first wrestled in the WWF was 1990.
• One could argue 'well click the association lightning bolt it takes you to The Rockers'. That's true, but then how do I know he was part of that tag team throughout all that run?
• According to the original listing, it only lists 1 of the 5 themes, and in 1990. It would lead me to believe that Shawn joined The Rockers in 1990.
• Look at Marty Jannetty's listing, it's just as bad only worse, because there's not even an entry for both his team of him and the 123 kid (even tag champs) and him on the New Rockers.
• Again, for a person without any existing knowledge, it would just look like Marty had a single theme in his entire WWF run and he was apparently solo.
• Back to Shawn’s further down we see he apparently used Rick Rude’s theme. That doesn’t seem right. However, if I follow the association link, it does take me to Rick Rude’s theme count.
• One could argue ‘well come on, everyone knows he was with D-Generation X’. How do I know that? Without previous knowledge to go by and without tag team/stable entries in there to clarify as such that’s what I would come away with.
• This is the issue and inherent flaw with doing this the way it is now. The overall profile accuracy is incorrect. It's also dangerously close to the philosophy that the elite at Discogs have turned the website into. It's solely focused on individual listings. It's not about overall accuracy and cohesion of the entry and how it integrates into an overall label or group.

A simple fix for people who want the solo counts to retain the solo first use dates but still include and retain the information I talked about would be to add a column to the left of the information which lists 'Solo' or 'Tag/Stable'. It would be the best of both worlds.

We need to keep in mind while we eat and breathe this stuff there's multitudes of people out there with entirely different knowledge spectrums. This should be comprehensive and able to make sense to the lowest common denominator. That's what I assumed and hoped this site was for in general: a resource for fans of all levels. Please put yourself in that perspective of what I mentioned above and then take this into consideration.

One last thing....with the new V7 redesign on the horizon, I think this is the perfect time to bring up the recommendation for a revamp to theme counts format, what the new replacement format is, and why it's been adopted by a lot of people- including myself. It's simple layout, universal compatibility between other people, and a fluid/easily adjustable count structure. I'll be making a post about that shortly here that I encourage you to check out.
Last edited by GodzFire on August 20th, 2023, 2:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by GodzFire »

This took a lot longer than I thought, but here's the post I spoke of above: "Revamp of theme count system and new modern replacement format".
viewtopic.php?t=16582

-----------------

EDIT: I'm posting some feedback from that thread that is relevant to the revamp format and how it'd integrate into V7:
Christopher wrote: August 19th, 2023, 9:37 pmI'm trying to think about it more in terms of the website (not as a database of filenames) and if/how it would be more user-friendly for a broader subset of casual themers....With that said, I'm curious about how your filename structure would translate to the Xylot site. Compared to TerranRich's X-Pac sample page for V7, what would your format look like so that all the info was accessible but in a way that was easily digestible for the "lowest common denominator"?
First, a simple fix for people who want the solo counts presents with the first use dates but still include and retain the information I talked about would be to add a column to the left of the information which lists 'Solo' or 'Tag/Stable'. It would be the best of both worlds.

Second, the the revamp format would be modified to fit into V7. It would include all gimmicks/tag/stables in a single listing by default (Terran said this will also be an option for displaying gimmicks separately so maybe a non issue). The same information just organized in a more optimized and straightforward fashion, something like:
[# w leading 0] | [yyyy mm-dd] [year version] | [solo/tag/stable] | [entity/gimmick] - [song, no quotes, capitalized case] [song major/minor version if applicable] [gimmick]

Then the fold out option would include stuff like [first used (show - yyyy mm-dd format)], artist, [source (instead of album)], notes, [proof] like the old site. The order of info of the primary entry definitely could be discussed, the goal is to try and keep things semi lined up so it's easier to browse through. One thing I bet Terran could easily program is a certain length separation (like column tabs) of the different pieces of information to help keep it uniform as well. The goal is for the different info entities to be modular on the back end, so they are easy to adjust, manage, and customize.

So for X-Pac:

OLD:
5th: “Make Some Noise” by Jim Johnston feat. Chris Warren, Lucky Luke & Prince Michael
^
Artist: Jim Johnston feat. Chris Warren, Lucky Luke & Prince Michael
Album: WWF: The Music, Vol. 3
Debut: RAW is WAR (June 15th, 1998)
Notes:Title from Jim Johnston's BMI page, and confirmed in a WWE.com article
Proof of Usage (0:13)

NEW (listed under Sean Waltman). I included a crude layout example:
Image
[05] 1998 06-15 | v2 | Solo | X-Pac - Make Some Noise
^
Debut: RAW is WAR - 1998 06-15
Artist: Jim Johnston feat. Chris Warren, Lucky Luke & Prince Michael
Source: WWF: The Music, Vol. 3
Notes: Title from Jim Johnston's BMI page, and confirmed in a WWE.com article
Usage Proof: 0:13
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by IAmNeomic »

TerranRich wrote: August 17th, 2023, 7:24 pm
IAmNeomic wrote: April 12th, 2023, 3:54 am Might be worth using ChatGPT to potentially speed up the process of V7, or maybe doing like a 6.5.

It's an AI chat bit that understands all programming languages, and people are starting to use it a lot for building websites, apps, games, etc. super quickly.
LMAO! What do you think I've been doing for V7?

Haha, touche! The V7 looks fantastic, btw. Happy to see it finally coming along.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by The Fiend »

TerranRich wrote: August 17th, 2023, 6:58 pm
Christopher wrote: August 16th, 2023, 1:42 pm
The Fiend wrote: August 16th, 2023, 12:45 pm I would love a feature for the Advanced Search to be able to search by Year and Event too.

It would be extremely helpful if you've taken a break from collecting for a few months to be able to say search 2023 and see all the listings used from this year.

And searching by events, if I searched WrestleMania and every theme first used at a WrestleMania pops up.
Yes! And production libraries, too.

I think it would also be neat to have the search be able to exclude terms as well. If you search up "Uncaged X" in the album field, for example, you'd also get results that include every other Uncaged album with an X in it of which there are 6.
The way the Drupal CMS (content management system) handles and stores data, this will be easily done. 👍
Thank you for the response, Rich! Going back to these extra Advanced Search options (Year, Event, Library, etc.)

Depending on how easy or difficult it may be, would it be possible if they can be included in the current version of the site or just wait until V7?

And maybe for the filtering as well, if say I searched 2023, I can also select an option to filter the companies as well? So only WWE shows up in my results instead of all company's at once.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by Christopher »

After all the releases today, I had an idea for V7.

Would it be possible to mark counts based on who is currently on the active roster for each company? Similar to how deceased wrestlers are marked, perhaps there would be a way to mark who is on the active roster, maybe even separate brands for WWE. I imagine initially this would be a lot of work, but then updating it would be quite simple going forward (even on days like today with so many releases).

Also, what about a way to mark what the most recently used theme was? In many counts, the last theme in the list may not be the most recent theme used, especially if it's an edit or has a special intro (Triple H's various WrestleMania intros, for example). Again, this would require a lot of initial work but I figure updates would be fairly simple.

Not sure how possible these are, or if they would be worth the work, but I figured I'd at least throw them out there.
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Re: Hello (or, V7 Stuff!)

Post by GodzFire »

Has there been any kind of movement for v7? Like I said previously, feature creep is a real and dangerous thing. It would be much better to get the base new overhaul out and then slowly add additions as time goes on, especially since it's been very long since v6 has been out and it's limitations are very apparent.
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